Fascism on the March in Arizona
SB-1070 would require police to attempt to determine the immigration status of anyone they encounter as part of a "lawful contact" and allow them to arrest undocumented immigrants and charge them with trespass. If residents believe police officers are not enforcing immigration laws, they can sue them. It would also outlaw the hiring of day laborers off the street and prohibit anyone from knowingly transporting an undocumented immigrant for any reason. The ACLU points out that SB-1070 unconstitutionally allows the state to regulate immigration -- a power which the Constitution assigns to the federal government. The ACLU also highlights a provision of the bill that grants police officers authority to conduct warrantless arrests of anyone who cannot immediately produce documents and notes that such action has already been deemed invalid by the Ninth Circuit Court. The ACLU concludes that the bill will "exacerbate racial profiling" and tries to "rewrite the Constitution by turning the presumption of innocence on its head." Several research institutions have also cited the high fiscal costs associated with local immigration crackdowns. The National Employment Law Project pointed out that smaller-scale anti-immigrant ordinances have cost individual localities millions of dollars. The Perryman Group estimates that if all unauthorized immigrants were removed from Arizona, the state would lose $26.4 billion in economic activity, $11.7 billion in gross state product, and approximately 140,324 jobs.I've never been particularly upset about illegal immigration. I really don't get what gets people so worked up about Mexicans coming here for a "better life". The fact is, they are coming here because someone is willing to pay these people-- better than in Mexico but under the minimum wage here. It just seems to me that if you want to stop illegal immigration, go after the freaking employers. Also, I'm pretty sure a great deal of US agriculture depends on illegal labor, so removing these laborers would make many produce items go way up in cost...
But in any case, this bill is clearly going to cause more trouble than solving anything, and it obviously has fascist elements.
UPDATE: This Arizona sheriff makes some interesting points against the law. This guy defends the law, not entirely convincingly to me.
UPDATE 2: Some news about Kris Kobach, who wrote the NYTimes piece.
posted by spooked at 8:55 PM
13 Comments:
Too many statements in your post are, in my opinion, either factually incorrect, illogical, or reach
conclusions that are not based on credible evidence.
* Illegals working as day laborers
WON'T work for less than $10 hour
in most cases - at least where I live.
* OVERpopulation, the result of
millions of illegals, drive up the cost of nearly everything - thus
offsetting what I concede might be
slightly higher prices for produce if illegal labor wasn't used.
As far as arresting and punishing
EMPLOYERS who hire illegals, I AGREE 100%. An aggressive, nationwide crackdown is long overdue.
i totally agree with nickname on this one. good for you AZ. and i wish CA. would follow suit.
no other so-called "first world" country allows ILLEGAL immigration - they will deport your ass as soon as they notice you.
plus, with all the feds phony bullshit about terrorism i would think they might at least pretend to be a little more concerned about open border.
I've nothing against removing illegal immigrants, I just don't think this bill is the right way to do it.
As far as wages, how many US citizens will work for the same wages and under the same conditions as illegals? Clearly, employers hire illegals for some reason-- I doubt they do it just out of compassion or because they want to break the law.
I think this bill sets a dangerous precedent that people need to carry "citizenship papers"-- and that this could be very easily abused.
As far as "overpopulation", I doubt that illegal immigrants contribute THAT much to overpopulation, percentage wise, and I really doubt that they affect overall prices significantly. Even if they do cause prices to go up, I bet the benefit they give to the economy offsets their negative effect.
Have you read much about the impact of illegal immigrants and the associated costs to society?
I bet you haven't. Is your employer one of those that derive
economic benefits from the swelling population of illegals here?
"Have you read much about the impact of illegal immigrants and the associated costs to society?"
Not that much, but from what I have seen, it is somewhat disputable how negative their impact is. And different sides of the debate tend to present the numbers in different ways.
My workplace does not depend at all on illegal immigrants, but does use legal immigrants quite a bit.
ok my town has hundeds of guys standing around, every day incl. sunday, on several major intersections, waiting for any kind of day labor that might come their way - unfortunately very little if not none ever does.
these guys urinate on the side of gas stations and defecate behind bushes - my friend works at said gas station and says that these guys somehow can afford to drink beer all day and night whilst hanging around.
that might be tolerable except their numbers increase on a weekly basis.
ok even that might be tolerable but several months ago this same friend of mine was mugged at knife-point on his way to work by 2 of these very same pillars of the community.
what do the police do? they take a statement and write a report but still these pillars of the community not only linger, but increase in numbers.
there are many letters/editorials in the newspaper denouncing this AZ legislation but every one of them leaves out one crucial word: ILLEGAL.
ILLEGAL immigrants are the issue, not immigrants in general.
5:54 PM-- how do you know any of those dudes are illegal?
Children are Watching
by stopdainsanity2
When I entered kindergarten – I was put into a class for the mentally retarded. Because my skin was brown my teacher assumed I did not speak English and required special bilingual support which was not available at the time. Yes – I was a Mexican-American citizen child AND I spoke English.
It literally took 2 weeks for my parents to force the school to place me in the mainstream kindergarten class — even though I could respond to questions in English. At the time if was easier for frustrated- overworked teachers (not bad people) to send me to the special needs class – no questions asked – based on my skin color. Although the error was corrected, as a child I never lost the feeling I was not welcomed and somehow my rights as a citizen were not equal to those of white americans. Be careful – children are watching.
how do you know any of those dudes are illegal?
because they scatter when a police car pulls up.
@10:41 - people are dick-heads, especially public school officials.
remember, the AZ legislation is about ILLEGAL immigration, not skin color or nationality. unfortunately, many mexican-american people are going to feel persecuted because of this.
what is the alternative, continue to tolerate a huge influx of foreigners every year?
there is an estimated 20-30 million illegal immigrants in this country already - that is almost 1 out of 10 people in the U.S.
About 120,000 illegal aliens per year are from commie China, a half million from the Republic of Georgia and another 750,000 from the Philippines and South America.
Arizona's new immigration law: Not all illegals are Mexicans
@10:37am--
yeah, but this still seems like law enforcement not doing their job more than not having the right law. If these guys are loitering and making trouble, it's hard to believe that the cops can't go after them, and then call immigration services if they arrest them.
actually, there is very little law enforcement in my town where these "day laborer" guys hang out.
people (of all colors) in my town seem to be able to dissuade crime in general and bad guys in particular.
i don't blame immigrants for coming here and wanting a better life but frankly, enough is enough.
anyway:
The ink is barely dry on Arizona’s new immigration control law and President Obama has already threatened to take legal action against the measure even though it was adopted from the federal statute that’s rarely enforced.
Obama Orders DOJ To Challenge Ariz. Immigration Law
IT WAS ADOPTED FROM THE FEDERAL STATUTE (that's rarely enforced)
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