Basic Justice, Basic Humanity

"Hardball" Thursday:

MATTHEWS: What about the charge made recently, just a couple minutes ago by Kate O'Beirne of the "National Review," that people who fight us who are not in uniform, who do not represent countries who are party to the Geneva Convention shouldn't be free riders? They shouldn't get Geneva Convention treatment. They should be treated like thugs.

SWIFT: Well, you know, if you're looking at it from that way, we have a lot of criminals here in this country. And to prejudge anyone that we capture outside the country as a thug, why are we having a trial in the first place? We've already decided they were guilty.

What the Supreme Court said is you have the trial first, you use the procedures that are set up under international law, and then you decide whether they're a thug. You don't make the thug determination going in.

snip

MATTHEWS: I only have a minute here, sir, and I appreciate your position, and I'm being tough with you because there is another side to this argument. Let me ask you, do you believe that people who fight us as terrorists deserve Geneva Convention treatment?

SWIFT: It's not whether they deserve it or not. It's how we conduct ourselves. It has to do where if we say that our opponent can cause us not to follow the rules anymore, then we‘ve lost who we are. We're the good guys. We're the guys who follow the rule and the people we fight are the bad guys and we show that every day when we follow the rules, regardless of what they do. It's what sets us apart. It‘s what makes us great and in my mind, it's what makes us undefeatable, ultimately.

MATTHEWS: Well, Commander Swift, I‘m sure you‘re going to have a place in history and you deserve it. What a great job you did, I‘ve been tough on you, but somebody has to defend the law and you‘ve done it. Thank you very much Lieutenant Charles Swift of the U.S. Navy.

As Digby says, Swift is a true American hero.